Instrument Cluster Problem

[Stevey Y]

18 hours ago, Hax said:

@Stevey YBefore I sent the unit off thte first time, I took a photo of the only label I could see on it.  I'm not sure what the required code would look like, are you able to advise if it is contained on this label please?

Hi unfortunately the code is contained within the barcode they went through a phase of that the same as Ford and every other manufacturer, all the Siemens injectors they used had the coding in the barcode so you just read it with a scanner, they stopped that when they realised platforms such as VCDS gave the long coding for the part even if you couldn't communicate with it, does it not show the long coding on OBD as some of the youtube tutorials on OBD show the part number with the coding.

Steve.

[Hax]

25 minutes ago, Stevey Y said:

Hi unfortunately the code is contained within the barcode they went through a phase of that the same as Ford and every other manufacturer, all the Siemens injectors they used had the coding in the barcode so you just read it with a scanner, they stopped that when they realised platforms such as VCDS gave the long coding for the part even if you couldn't communicate with it, does it not show the long coding on OBD as some of the youtube tutorials on OBD show the part number with the coding.

Steve.

I called Audi this morning.  They quoted me £1600 for a new part.  I then tried a couple of local garages, only one could help, but again it would have to be a new part as the VAG system flags up if you try to recode an old part - so they quoted me £1400.

As a shot in the dark, I have just bought a new cluster from eBay to be sent to ECUTesting to see if they can copy the code over from my dead one - they told me that they could at least talk to it, so there is a little bit of hope there.

With the OBD, I couldn't get anything out of the instrument cluster at all - when I clicked it in the app on my phone, it just popped up a message saying it couldn't communicate.

[Stevey Y]

36 minutes ago, Hax said:

I called Audi this morning.  They quoted me £1600 for a new part.  I then tried a couple of local garages, only one could help, but again it would have to be a new part as the VAG system flags up if you try to recode an old part - so they quoted me £1400.

As a shot in the dark, I have just bought a new cluster from ebay to be sent to ECUTesting to see if they can copy the code over from my dead one - they told me that they could at least talk to it, so there is a little bit of hope there.

With the OBD, I couldn't get anything out of the instrument cluster at all - when I clicked it in the app on my phone, it just popped up a message saying it couldn't communicate.

Hi I have just been having a look at the OBD web site and it looks like its only the pro version you can long code with but they have to have an app for that year and model which you have to buy, I think ECU Testing is about your best hope as with the equipment they have if they can talk to the replacement unit there is a good chance they can delete the existing code and replace it with your original coding, nearly all VAG equipped garages are connected online to VAG so the guy is correct when he says the head office won't have it as they only want them coding new parts.

Steve.

[Hax]

The "Pro" part of OBDeleven is simply a subscription that can be bought to give the functionality. 

For now, I will just wait to see what the next week brings... 

[Hax]

I have today received back both instrument clusters from ECUTesting - the original, faulty one and the second hand one I bought that they did a code transfer to.

Fitted the replacement unit and all seems to be looking good so far.  I had numerous warnings which I have cleared with the OBDeleven device and the car starts and runs just fine.

I had a stability system warning which went after about 30 yeards of driving.

Now, I am left with a TPMS warning.  I've read that this is also something that can "go away" with some driving.  BUT.... I don't think I actually have TPMS on my car. I have never before noticed anything to do with it. I think it is just the replacement cluster must be expecting to find one. So, next job is to look into how I can disable that module completely. Or maybe it has always been there and I have just never had any warning and therefore simply not noticed.

Any thoughts on how I can determine if this is even fitted to my car? 

 

[cliffcoggin]

Good to hear you have a working car again. Fingers crossed it stays that way.

Afraid I can't help with TPMS.

[Stevey Y]

8 hours ago, Hax said:

I have today received back both instrument clusters from ECUTesting - the original, faulty one and the second hand one I bought that they did a code transfer to.

Fitted the replacement unit and all seems to be looking good so far.  I had numerous warnings which I have cleared with the OBDeleven device and the car starts and runs just fine.

I had a stability system warning which went after about 30 yeards of driving.

Now, I am left with a TPMS warning.  I've read that this is also something that can "go away" with some driving.  BUT.... I don't think I actually have TPMS on my car. I have never before noticed anything to do with it. I think it is just the replacement cluster must be expecting to find one. So, next job is to look into how I can disable that module completely. Or maybe it has always been there and I have just never had any warning and therefore simply not noticed.

Any thoughts on how I can determine if this is even fitted to my car? 

 

Hi check your screen menu it should have TPMS reset facility on it, from memory the good old E.U made the system compulsory in about 2010.

Steve.

[Hax]

12 minutes ago, Stevey Y said:

Hi check your screen menu it should have TPMS reset facility on it, from memory the good old E.U made the system compulsory in about 2010.

Steve.

I have this but it won't accept the setting... 🙄

I found one of the adaptation settings for the the instrumentation allows TPMS to be turned off, only it doesn't actually turn off when I change that BIT. 

I went for a half hour drive this afternoon as I read there are two types of TPMS one of which works it out from the wheel rotation. But that also did not fix the warning

[Hax]

OK - I have managed to get the TPMS problem to "go away".

I found that bytes 16 and 17 of the ABS long coding both had fields relating to the TPMS system. Twiddling the bit in byte 16 made no difference to me. So I tried byte 17 and it has now disappeared.

Unfortunately, it was starting to get dark and I had to take the dog for a walk before it was too late so I don't have specific details, but tomorrow I will go back out in the daylight and make a note of the settings to share on here for anyone else who may find it useful.

In a nutshell, the ODBeleven has paid for itself just for fixing this one problem. £50 for the device and then another £20 for one year of "Pro" subscription.  Money well spent IMHO - thanks for the recommendation for that @Stevey Y

And also, despite the extended lag over the quoted 2-3 days service, I have nothing but praise for ECUTesting - I am so happy that they were so helpful with this problem and that they were also willing to receive a used part direct from an eBay seller and to then successfully carry out a code swap from the dead unit to the replacement. Thanks again for recommending them also @Stevey Y

[Stevey Y]

21 hours ago, Hax said:

OK - I have managed to get the TPMS problem to "go away".

I found that bytes 16 and 17 of the ABS long coding both had fields relating to the TPMS system. Twiddling the bit in byte 16 made no difference to me. So I tried byte 17 and it has now disappeared.

Unfortunately, it was starting to get dark and I had to take the dog for a walk before it was too late so I don't have specific details, but tomorrow I will go back out in the daylight and make a note of the settings to share on here for anyone else who may find it useful.

In a nutshell, the ODBeleven has paid for itself just for fixing this one problem. £50 for the device and then another £20 for one year of "Pro" subscription.  Money well spent IMHO - thanks for the recommendation for that @Stevey Y

And also, despite the extended lag over the quoted 2-3 days service, I have nothing but praise for ECUTesting - I am so happy that they were so helpful with this problem and that they were also willing to receive a used part direct from an ebay seller and to then successfully carry out a code swap from the dead unit to the replacement. Thanks again for recommending them also @Stevey Y

Hi I am really pleased you have a result, but more to the point THANK YOU for the feed back, one of the hardest things to do is autodiagnosis from description and you have been nothing less than forthcoming with information so therefore a pleasure to help, I would never recommend anything I have not used or seen used as that will lead to extra expense which I did when I was a lot younger, so I am well aware of the feelings of loss financially and disappointment that it hasn't worked.

You would be amazed at the amount of people that post and get everybody at it, they get a possible solution and disappear into cyberspace so all contributors, Steve,Gareth,Clifford and myself never know the outcome which is most frustrating, because you wanted to help yourself you are now armed with the right tool for the job you have my upmost respect and I look forward to your settings tutorial as the name of the game on here is to starve the dealers of potential victims.

Regards Steve.

 

 

 

[Hax]

Firstly, please note that all screenshots are from the OBDeleven app.  I bought the "old" generation device for about £50 from Amazon and then paid another £21 to purchase a year's subscription of the OBDeleven "Pro" version of the tools.  It is worth noting, that the only advantages the newer generation of OBDelven gives are:

• Able to use it with an iPhone
• Potential future support for other cars such as BMW

So, if you are using an Android phone and are only intending to work on VAG cars, there is no apparent benefit to paying the extra for the "next gen" version.  YMMV. 

___

Also note that this relates to a 2012 Audi A3 8P 1.6D hatchback. It is probably that it will apply to other, similar models in the range and of a similar age. Regardless, maybe it will help to provide people with some direction if hunting for a similar problem on their car.

___

Now, to the issue I was having - my instrument cluster failed and was irrepairable.  However, the company ECUTesting were able to transfer the code from my "dead" cluster into another, second hand cluster.  This process seems to have been successful and, at a total cost of about £380 (including the purchase of my OBDeleven device and Pro subscription) has saved me over £1200 when compared to the £1600 Audi were wanting to charge for a new instrument cluster (plus the probably £100 fee for having my car towed to their garage!)

When I got the "cloned" instrument cluster back, there were some superficial warnings showing up in OBDeleven all of which were cleared with the press of a button.  However, two warnings remained: one relating to the steering sensor and another relating the TPMS.  The steering sensor warning/error cleared within about 30 yards of just driving the car.

The TPMS warning however was more stubborn and beligerent.  It manifestied with a warning message when the ignition was truned on, relating to TPMS (too quick for me to catch sorry) displayed on the information panel, followed by a persistent, "amber" TPMS" warning banner on the instrument panel.  This was coupled with the lower tyre pressure "icon" being iluminated on the left-hand side of the instrument cluster.

There was a menu option available in the instrument panel to save the current tyre pressure values, but when selecting this, I simply got a message back informing me that this operation had failed.

Obviously, the first tool in my arsenal is Google. A quick search revealed to me that there are two types of TPMS - one that makes use of pressure sensors that are fitted to the wheel itself and these then transmit the information to another module.  The second type uses some magic mathematics to do with the ABS sensors and calculates whether a tyre is flat based on the rotational profiles of the wheels as you drive - pretty cool stuff.I also came across a post on another forum where someone had an issue and it turned out that their car had both types of TPMS enabled instead of just one.

So, this left me with a couple of questions.  Firstly, does my car even have any form of TPMS?  I don't remember seeing anything relating to this since owning the car.  Next, assuming it does, what type does it have?

As the replaced part was the instrument panel, my initial instinct was that it was simply misconfigured and I so I investigated the options available through the OBDeleven app for the instrumentation panel and came across the following option under adapation:

Here, I could see that the bit was set to enable TPMS and so I decided to simply change this bit to disable.  Unfortunately, this had no effect what so ever and the warning message and light just continued to stare back at me... 

Next step was some more Google searching where I came across a thread someone else had posted on another forum where they appeared to have both versions of TPMS enabled. A bit more digging on Google and hunting through OBDeleven and I discovered that the magic settings may exist within the ABS module which, for the "rotational" version of TPMS makes sense - but I didn't expect the sensor variant to also be controlled through here.  But it turns out they are.  Entering the long coding menu for the ABS module and navigating to bytes 16 and 17 reveals the following settings:

I will be honest here, I have no idea what the "TPMS Reset" bit on byte 16 does - it seemed to make no difference to me so I returned it to being unset and left well alone.

The "Tire pressure monitoring" bit on byte 16 seems (well I am guessing here) to indicate whether the TPMS uses sensors - the value underneath toggles between "Installed" and "Not installed" depending on the setting.

On byte 17, "Tire pressure monitoring via instrument cluster (2011+)" seems to indicate that the TPM operates using the rotation calculation and again, the value toggles between "Installed" and "Not installed".

There is some interaction between these settings. Setting the bit on byte 17 (to indicate TPMS via the cluster is installed) resulted in the amber warning message in the instrumentation panel going away. However, the flat tyre warning icon remained illuminated. Clearing the "Tire pressure monitoring" bit (so that it shows to be "Not installed") resulted in this icon being extinguished.

Well, the settings above are the ones that seem appropriate for my car and I now have no TPMS warnings.  It remains to be seen if the rotational calculation works and I get a warning - for that to happen, I will need to pick up a puncture whilst driving - something I hope will not be happening in the near future!

I hope this helps someone else who may also be suffering from such a problem - I know this started out as an instrumentation cluster failure and has nor morphed into a TPMS setting "tutorial" (for want of a better word?) - if anyone thinks the particular post would better serve by living somewhere else on the forums, feel free to move it or let me know where to put it and I will happily duplicate the info there.

Edited March 29, 2022 by Hax
Added links to ECUtesting and OBDeleven

[Adam bullock]

Hi, i have the same problem, what was the fix with yours in the end please? 

[Hax]

Hello, I sent mine off to ECUTesting but it was beyond repair. But fortunately, they were able to clone the data into another unit I sourced from eBay and had sent to them.

After that, there were a few anomalies that needed tweaking as I detailed in my last (rather long) post here.

Good luck

[Steve69Smith]

Hi ya. I have exact problem with my 2010 Audi A3 convertible. Same lights on but everything else works fine & drives fine. Just no mileage, fuel gauge, temp gauge, speedometer, rev meter, clock etc. Did you get this problem fixed, what was the outcome? Any help highly appreciated.

[cliffcoggin]

If you read the entire thread you will find the problem, the solution, and the cost all thoroughly explained'

[Steve69Smith]

Ok so here is update on my problem. I noticed my DRL (daytime running lights) were switched on. I checked the power on the battery which was somewhere between 20% & 40% I then charged the battery to 100% & my dash had returned to normal full working. Now I just can't work out how or why there was no alarm when disengaging the key to tell me the DRL lights were on. I have an alarm for normal head lights but not DRL lights, strange. Also my stereo worked normal when driving, my cabriolet roof worked as normal & my windows worked as normal. I would have thought these would have been affected more than speedometer, rev meter, fuel gauge etc with lack of power in battery. Very happy was quick free fix. Check your battery if you have this problem before the other explained expensive solution.

[cliffcoggin]

Stephen.

A defective battery is well known to cause a variety of electrical and electronic faults, so in fact your problem is absolutely unrelated to Hax's problem. Please do not assume that because your car shows the same symptoms as somebody else, it has the same fault.

I suggest you start a topic of your own. In the meantime I am locking this topic to avoid it being derailed by irrelevencies.